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Bring Rich Coyle (Racprops) back? A poll for the community.
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Should Rich Coyle (Racprops) be unbanned?
Bring him back, undo his ban.
 61%  [ 37 ]
Keep him banned.
 38%  [ 23 ]
Total Votes : 60

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amish
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Location: Outside Philadelphia

PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 1:16 pm    Post subject: Bring Rich Coyle (Racprops) back? A poll for the community. Reply with quote

Hello everyone,

Sometime ago, Rich Coyle was banned from Propsummit. I do not want to get into the specifics of it, but at the time, it was the proper thing to do for Propsummit.

Anyway, much time has past, and I think it was time that we look at unbanning his membership.

While he may not want to even log in here again, if unbanned, he would be welcome like any other member.

It was decided by all the community guides that we should allow the members here to have a say in bringing him back. So, in short, it is up to the membership.

So, take a look at the poll and vote what you believe is best.

I will vote to bring him back in hopes that everyone can benefit from his presence and he ours. Like I said, he may not want to appear here again, but he either will or will not be welcome depending on all of us here.

edit: I just wanted to add, in case anyone wonders, the poll is anonymous, unless you want to post a comment about your vote.
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Last edited by amish on Tue Oct 27, 2009 5:32 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Bwood
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 6:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Can you explain what is the value in bringing him back?
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hirohawa
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 6:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I voted to bring him back. Rich is a knowledgeable craftsman that has spent more time working on and researching the BR blaster than almost anyone else alive.

I don't really care about his shortcomings (perceived or real) in regards to his personality or beliefs - that is not what I come to this board for anyway.

Rich has a wealth of knowledge that I feel he has always gone out of his way to share.

And he drove to World Con just to get his hands on the hero blaster. I live in LA and still couldn't find time to get down to the PIH auction.

Also as evidenced by Eltee's recent thread he is indeed improving upon the WC Blaster he makes.
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oldzey
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 7:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Voted Aye (Bring him back, undo his ban).
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Bassnoir
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 7:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

...I vote to bring him back.....my dealings with him have all been good and honorable.....
David
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The Loyalizer
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 9:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I say lift his ban, if he goes off the deep end again, he can be banned again. Its not like we're talking about the electric chair after all.
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Staar
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 10:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Without doubt, Rich is one of the doyens of the BR blaster community and my limited dealings with him were especially decent. Without doubt his skills are appreciated amongst many of the members here (me included) as is his quest in producing an excellent Blaster reproduction.

ALL of us here have different takes on this franchise - some rigidly film accurate and others less so and since this is a subjective thing, I don't believe any specific attitude is 'the "right one". Likewise different opinions and takes on the blaster - WorldCon, weathered, new issue, film accurate, Resin, Rich, Rick, Sid.. and so on, and so on and so forth..

Rich can be a grumpy bugger but I feel with his background and experience he can contribute handsomely.
We just need to remember that bringing him back could spice things up again but without Sid in the room I think its unlikely that it will reach the same irrational heat.

Personally, I voted to see him back..
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The Loyalizer
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 10:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually I think it was more the Ham Salad guy that set Rich off, Sid was just caught in the crossfire afterwards.
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Mr Webber
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 18, 2009 12:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The mods here have shown swift, fair and decisive leadership in the past when situations went beyond the ideals of the community.
With this in place there is no reason why Rich cant once again tread these boards.
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Nexus6
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 18, 2009 2:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I voted 'No'. (Shocked)

amish, to not "get into the specifics" of why he was banned is to not allow newer members (or even long-standing members who may have forgotten) the ability to make an informed decision on the issue.

And let NO ONE be naive, as long as people are willing to throw large sums of money at him, he ABSOLUTELY, POSITIVELY WILL "want to appear here again."

There are 14 threads. 14 THREADS in the pit right now, that had to be moved there by the mods, that were hopelessly hijacked to overflowing, with the menstruating tirades of Rich Coyle. Among those threads is the one that apparently got him banned due to several posts where he spouted a string of racist remarks; offending many members, including a mod or two.

You couldn't even show-off a Sidkit build without him crapping all over the thread screaming "RECASTER!!!!!!" & calling the owner of the sidkit (& anyone who posted positive comments in the thread) recaster-supporting "scumbag(s)." But hey, who knows, he may be able to keep a civil, yet grammatically incorrect, tongue in his head from now on. After all, his primary competition (& self-perceived arch nemesis) is dead.

To all who disagree with my opinion, that is your right, & don't hold it against you (as if what I think of anyone is relevant). However, I might hurl a couple "I-told-you-so's" after his next meltdown.

This will be my only input on this subject.
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Gaff87
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 18, 2009 9:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I voted to bring Rich back.
I've only spoken to Rich a couple of times and haven't had any problems with him.
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amish
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 18, 2009 12:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nexus6,

I agree with you, everything you say is true about his behavior here. I cannot deny that. That is why I feel it should be up to the community as a whole rather then just four of us.

If anyone wants to read up on everything that transpired, please search for either "coyle" or "racprops" in the section of the forum called "The Pit". While there is still some threads that did not get moved to the Pit, most of the problems can be seen through the search.

Also, I would like everyone to have input on this. That is why I posted the poll.

I am unsure if other forums offer the opportunity to its members to vote if someone should be banned or unbanned, and who knows if it is really a good idea. All I know is that it is worth a try to see how it works.

I hope everyone will chime in if they feel like it. We are all adults here, I think, and should be able to have this type of conversation.

Thank you all again for your input.

Tom
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Once-bitten
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 18, 2009 1:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm in COMPLETE agreement with Nexus6 on this and voted "NO" to the idea of allowing COYLE back.
All the "input" he ever gave here was to point out how the Blaster details that he and Phil Steinschneider
(if he bothered to give him any credit) had sussed out were the "Gospel" and if anyone disagreed with him or offered an alternate point of view,
they got flamed.
Let's also not forget that he was constantly HOCKING his blasters to the poor unsuspecting fools who also bought his HYPE.
I STILL wonder why the all caps BANNED never appeared under his profile pic here as it ALWAYS appeared under the name of every other BANNED member. After all, he earned it.
I view the BANNING of Rich Coyle as one of the PIVOTAL defining moments of this board...
Let's NOT forget that he has his own web-site to offer his brand of input and where he tells his version of the truth all the time...if people REALLY feel a need to be in his presence they can go there.
I don't offer any appologies for the way I feel about Coyle...
I gave him my trust, he earned my distrust and disapproval.
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amish
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 18, 2009 2:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Once-bitten wrote:
I STILL wonder why the all caps BANNED never appeared under his profile pic here as it ALWAYS appeared under the name of every other BANNED member. After all, he earned it.
I view the BANNING of Rich Coyle as one of the PIVOTAL defining moments of this board...


Good question, I cannot remember why that did not go under his name. If I recall, like I said earlier, his account was not supposed to be banned forever as you can see in his ban announcement here:
http://propsummit.com/viewtopic.php?t=965

Otherwise, if that offended someone, I apologize it was an oversight on my part, then again it has been over a year and unfortunately, my memory is not perfect. I will be more careful in the future.

Great discussion by everyone.

Thanks for the input,

Tom
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oldzey
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 18, 2009 3:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is obviously still a hot topic.

I had brought this up previously when I mentioned that I missed Rich's input on the board in this topic:
http://propsummit.com/viewtopic.php?t=1609

I did receive an e-mail from Rich about my Sidkit archive a few months ago. He called it a "whitewash" and said that that I wasn't presenting the full side of the story (i.e. that Sid recasted his blaster and other propmakers' work). I can understand his point of view, but I think the archive serves a purpose for those who own or have recently acquired Sidkit props (especially for kits that need building up and with the Sidkit.com website being down, lack instructions or reference images).

Even though I think Rich deserves another chance, I do think it would be hard for him to resist commenting on all the Sidkit threads on the site, including mine. I can put myself in his shoes and say that I'd be pissed too if I were convinced someone ripped me off and people were singing that someone's praises.

I think what is most risky is that if Rich returns and someone baits him regarding Sid, then you know Rich won't turn the other cheek (and we'll be back at square one with posts moved to the pit).

No easy answers here regarding Mr. Coyle. On one hand, he is a polarizing figure and people have strong feelings about his personality. On the other hand, he is a seminal figure in the world of Blade Runner props and his professional work is top notch. If everyone including Rich could let Sid rest in peace, then maybe Rich's expertise could once again be welcomed, appreciated, and be a benefit to the board. He also might sell a few blasters in the process.

Just my two cents worth...

Dave


Last edited by oldzey on Sun Oct 18, 2009 3:57 pm; edited 1 time in total
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joberg
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 18, 2009 3:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I voted to return Rich to the board; I can see valid reasons why other members would like to see him banned forever (unless he took an oath swearing as not to implode/explode while others are showing their Sidkit blaster ).
I made a list of good/bad things about Rich and came to the conclusion that the good side is a little longer (not by a huge margin mind you) than the bad one...Yes Amish; we're all adults here and it's up to us to be patient (within limits of course) with some of his "knee jerk reaction" kinda rant. Only time will tell...
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amish
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 18, 2009 5:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

joberg wrote:
I voted to return Rich to the board; I can see valid reasons why other members would like to see him banned forever (unless he took an oath swearing as not to implode/explode while others are showing their Sidkit blaster ).
I made a list of good/bad things about Rich and came to the conclusion that the good side is a little longer (not by a huge margin mind you)than the bad one...Yes Amish; we're all adults here and it's up to us to be patient (within limits of course)with some of his "knee jerk reaction" kinda rant. Only time will tell...


Understood completely. If he is to come back, that same type of outbursts that happened in the past from him would not be tolerated. This community is too important to myself and everyone else here to allow any one person to seperate us.
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eltee
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 18, 2009 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have probably known Rich Coyle longer than most, if not all, of you. Yes, he is eccentric, temperamental and sometimes I need a Coyle to English Dictionary to decipher his missives. I have also seen the side of Rich which is creative, ingenious, generous and helpful. How many of us have asked Rich for a technical detail, help, info, or repairs (for damage we caused) and had him come through for us?

Like so many people in the entertainment industry, he is polarizing and misbehaves. Like him, loathe him or love him but he is always going to be a recognized name in the prop (real and replica) industry and in the Bladerunner universe.

I voted to bring him back into the fold. So what if he hawks his wares, don't most of us who have something to sell do the same? Just this month I saw first hand physical evidence that supports Rich's assertions that Siderio reverse engineered one of his blasters. To me, so what? Siderio was gifted in his own right and now that he has passed Rich should be respectful to a deceased, fellow prop producer.

If he mouths off or violates any of the forum rules the moderator(s) can ban him again or send him to an off-world colony for ten years at hard labor. Consider his return as parole. We'd be, IMHO, cutting off our collective noses to spite our faces if we excluded him from being part of this Bladerunner prop community.

If you don't like him or his entries, don't read anything that he's submitted. Just censor him on a personal, individual level but please don't deprive those who WANT to read what he writes of the opportunity.

Of course, Rich might just decline any offer to return. Exclamation
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amish
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 18, 2009 5:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Eltee,

Very good post. Not much else to say.

Tom
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oldzey
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 18, 2009 8:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yup,

Nice nod to Rich's professionalism there Eltee - Rich is an enduring propmaker whose knowledge, expertise, and even his piss and vinegar are conspicuously absent here at Propsummit. He repaired my blaster when I messed it up free of charge and has sent me parts that I requested (as well as casting up some .357 Leon's pistols on demand that I had requested).

Professionally speaking, having Rich banned from Propsummit is like if Indy Magnoli (a prolific Indiana Jones prop maker) were to be banned from Club Obi Wan (one of the most recognized Indiana Jones boards on the Internet).

Dave
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