• AN OPTICAL ILLUSION

[Replicant 13]

ASIDE FROM MRS. DECKARD, WHAT'S DECKARD HOLDING IN HIS LEFT HAND?

Studying various reference, online and elsewhere, I noticed a detail that I have overlooked before and wondered if any one has an answer or thought about it -

Almost impossible to determine from the resolution and quality of most captures, Deckard seems to be holding something in his left hand. The dark shadow could be from just his hand, but it also looks as if he is holding something as his arm rests on Iran's shoulder.



- A almost-empty wine glass? An awkward grasp as Deckard's hand still doesn't seem posed to holding it securely. And they both have drinks in hand in more regular table glasses . . .

- A bottle? Deckard's left thumb shows no indication of wrapping around the shape of a normal bottle . . .

- A camera? The dark shadow under his hand could be hiding something, but the circular shape (indicated) doesn't figure in as anything immediately recognizable.

My best guess is they had a guest over (the one who took the photo?). The guest drank their wine and upon leaving relinquished his wine glass back to its owner. Rick simply held it while the photo was taken. Plausible - maybe?

Any thoughts? Guesses? Or does anyone just have the answer?

HAB1! - R13
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Gosh, you've really got some nice toys here . . .

[Spoony]

Resolution makes it difficult to tell, but to my eyes his hand is just dangling over the shoulder and not actually gripping anything (you can make out the fingers and thumb that don't appear go have anything between them).
To me, the highlighted bit seems more like a watch strap or shadow of a shirt cuff.

[Replicant 13]

Agreed, Spoony. And thanks for the input.

His hand does look like it's just resting over her shoulder (and so I overlooked it before), but yet in most of the pictures I've found there is that questionable circle above his hand that appears to be something. Either it's the upper rim of a glass catching the light, some other object, or even possibly a defect in the print(?), although I doubt the latter.

Again his relaxed hand hardly supports the idea that he's holding something, but it's a detail that perhaps someone here knows about. Perhaps he is holding the base of the glass, pinching it between his thumb and index finger.

Knowing the various glasses used in the movie, perhaps this is one of those with a colored base and clear top - similar to those at The Snake Pit. A colored stem and base might render the base virtually invisible beneath his thumb . . .



Other thoughts? - R13
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Gosh, you've really got some nice toys here . . .

[joberg]

Right you are Rep13...sorry, I was on vacation with no E-devices for a week .
I'm glad that you're tackling this subject; I thought I was the only one thinking that Deck was holding something in his hand
Your theory is actually not far from mine: same glass as the people in the pic. Person taking the picture gave his napkin and the wine glass to Deck.
Deck is holding the napkin/the wine glass is held by the base, not the stem.

Strange shadow is made, I believe, by the unevenly folded napkin.
I'll get my popcorn

[Replicant 13]

Joberg -

interesting thought. A napkin had not occurred to me. Probably since neither Rick nor Iran seem to have one.

I assume that their glasses are the garden-variety cylindrical glass, perhaps dictated by their choice of drink.

Whether 'the glass in question' is a standard wine glass or 2-colored, I will proceed with your suggestion in mind. Perhaps (assuming there is a guest) it makes more sense.

. . . And then it could be that the napkin was Deckard's all along. How very hygienic of him.

Perhaps he suspected his guest was a synthetic(?) .

HAB1! - R13
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Gosh, you've really got some nice toys here . . .

[Bwood]

"Nothing in the hand, nothing up the sleeve.." I think the shadow combined with the pattern on her blouse is confusing everybody. My question is, is this the same woman?
http://propsummit.com/upload/696/__brdsdeckardandwifecab.jpg

[joberg]

I looked at this pic for a long time and I, like you Bwood, thought that the shadow + the pattern on her blouse was creating that funky form...
But, over the years, and trying to replicate that shadow, I found myself returning again toward the napkin theory

The glass could cast a shadow, albeit very faint (or no shadow at all for that matter), the hand, holding the glass by the base, is more or less a closed fist (that shouldn't take much "space" into that shadow); add the napkin and, I think, the resulting effect is much closer to the pic we have now.

The black dot on her blouse can easily be found (perfect circle).

[Replicant 13]

No doubt some would say we are overthinking this, but that's what we do, right?

I have to lean toward Joberg's theory. The more I look at it. Yes, the combination of shadows, the pattern of her (apparent) wrap-around top and the poor resolution of then image are confusing, but until someone produces a better image os the real thing, tis interpretation makes sense, I think.

A detail not necessarily intended in the actual photo/prop, it might also make sense that out of habit, Deckard (as a cop) might hold any item as though it were a piece of evidence, hence the napkin . . .

- - - - -

As to "Iran", having studied her facial structure, the jaw line, her checks and complexion, I think there's a reasonable 80/20+ that it is her in both pictures - the porch shot and the closeup in the car. The hair vs. the hat and a smile can change someone's appearance significantly and women can be like chameleons, with changes in makeup, hair color and attitude (obviously, no insult intended).




But keep the thoughts coming!

HAB1! - R13[/b]
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Gosh, you've really got some nice toys here . . .

[andy]

The photo mystery is very intriguing. I wonder if it could be a hoop earring, or hoop from a dangling earring? The more I look at it though, it does look like Deck is double fisting it.

Andy

[Bwood]

The fact that they are both holding glasses in their hand would preclude the logical possibility of a third glass, I would think. If it's an earring, it's a long way from the ear...

[Replicant 13]

Don't think it's a earring. As you said, too far to the right. And rather large.

As stated earlier, one might suppose that they had a guest, who possibly took the photo (somebody did), and that might explain the third glass . . .

- R13
_________________
Gosh, you've really got some nice toys here . . .

[Replicant 13]

OK. Taking this a step further, here's a guess. As good as any at this point - I think.

Deckard is holding the mystery guest's almost-empty wine glass (indicated with a green line), the base of which is semi-obscurred by a dark napkin (blue line). The shadow, blending with the pattern on Iran's blouse is difficult to define, but perhaps the two points (indicated with pink lines) reveal the corners poking out beyond one of the black circles in the fabrics design.



Again, a guess, based on the input here, but I think reasonable. Of course, it's still open to debate and any other ideas are welcome.

- R13
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Gosh, you've really got some nice toys here . . .

[andy]

I keep looking at the photos and It does look like it could be a glass, but there really should be some shadow of the glass similar to what is on the column from the one in his other hand. The dark napkin/shadow does look a little like it could be a shadow from a hand. Also parts of the circle look like they could be a case where unrelated details line up to make a circle and we are filling in the blanks in our head. Very gestalt. The left portion of the circle looks to be the same color of some of the dots on her dress and cold just be a dot on it's side and curling up her collar. The middle portion look like it could be just the edge of his hand. The only part that looks like it is not made up from what we know is in the picture is the small light ark that is to the right and above. It could be something in the background. Sure it is a lot of what if, but I have seen it happen time and time again. Just trying to consider all possibilities.

Andy

Edit: I am looking at a higher res image of the photo I printed out a while ago, and am looking for the digital file now. In this one I can see more clearly the shadow of his thumb on her dress and the lines on the left part of the circle and middle part to be clearly part of his sleeve and her collar with shadows, and the part on the right upper part looks much less circular, but still not sure where it comes from.

[andy]

A little sample of what I found (the full image is too big to load here)....



No glass from what I can see here.

Andy

[Mr Webber]

A pair of sunglasses maybe?
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Formerly offworld66

[Replicant 13]

When I was child my mother and I would look up at the clouds and try to find recognizable shapes. We've all done it - seen faces, animals and things in patterns, in rocks, everywhere.

As I said earlier, we could be accused of overthinking this. There may well be nothing there at all, but it's another unknown. A challenge. Admittedly, a self-assigned puzzle. But if we determine something that no one else has - COOL!

I think there's "something" there. It could be sunglasses - another idea I had not considered. I still tend to see the bowl of a wine glass tipped forward with a slight bit of wine left, but there seems to be no obvious stem. So I could be way off . . .


But looking at Deckard's/Harrison's hand, I do think his fingers would be a bit more relaxed if his hand was indeed empty.

There's still more questions than actual answers.

Without definitive proof, this could be considered an exercise in futility. I think the search is what makes this interesting. The discoveries here are rewarding, but they're seldom more fun than the quest.

It took three years before Southwell ended my first quest here with his generous information, opening additional doors to answers we have all searched for decades.

Someone knows.

...'The Truth Is Out There' - R13
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Gosh, you've really got some nice toys here . . .

[Replicant 13]

As I posted my last remark, looking again at a version of the photo Andy posted, another thought struck me!

Like the clouds, every time I look at this I imagine something different, perhaps due to varying resolutions and detail in the image I am studying.

This time, the circle I assumed was the rim of the wine glass seemed less complete and looking at the way Deckard's hand is posed, it still seemed he was holding something . . .



Could Deckard be holding a pipe?

We know there are opium pipes throughout the club scenes, and although there is no actual reference made to Deckard smoking in BR, perhaps an occasional toke along with his Johnnie Walker enhances his electric dreams(?)

It would appear he might be holding it by the bowl, with the stem forming a partial arch above his thumb. What I saw as wine and the rest of the "rim" was a shadow on his sleeve and a little imagination.

Looking further now, what I saw as a blemish or imperfection in the photo - just above his hand - could be a slight indication (a whiff) of smoke. Or I am now the one dreaming?

Thoughts? - R13
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Gosh, you've really got some nice toys here . . .

[andy]

The line above his hand seems to end behind his hand. Maybe a loose watch strap sticking out of his sleeve, or even something like from the production team, including a property tag from the wardrobe dept that never got tucked in. Also the shadows line up perfectly with his fingers and thumb, with the black dot on her dress adding a little to the shape of the shadow. I don't see anything else in there, but the darkness of the shadow does let the imagination go. The other shadows on her dress also seem a bit dark though too. I may have to go back to view the BluRay set and see the original image again. I bet it shows even more because even the one I have is more than second generation, but every one of us should have the closest thing in their collections now. If only Tom has a copy of the original

Andy

[Replicant 13]

Having slept on this, it's the one curved artifact that began this puzzle. Based on the points suggested here, in the end, it's the one thing that's really in question.

I don't think it's a wristband. And it's not the fabricated wine glass and napkin that Joberg and I saw. The pipe seemed logical, but I don't know what I was smoking . . .

Based on the photo Andy provided, here's what I take as fact -



The little curved line remains the mystery. it doesn't seem to be anything in the far background. It could be the "tie" on a leather wristband, or something associated with the shirt, but exactly what it is remains a guess until someone who actually knows responds here or elsewhere with a definitive answer.

Like faces in the clouds, for now it's all in the mind's eye. Amazing what we envisioned it to be.

Thanks of the contributions! - R13
_________________
Gosh, you've really got some nice toys here . . .

[joberg]

Defo a wine glass. I made some photo experiments years ago with shadows and glasses (various types: wine, whisky, Champagne flutes filled with various liquids).
Depending of the light (angle, intensity, etc) the glass will, always, cast some kind of shadow. The smaller and rounder the glass, the better shadow it seems (see Deck's shadow on the column, you see a good shadow of his glass).

The blouse is adding to the challenge of course, and some here have even thought of Deck smoking...
A few people know (Harrison of course)...hopefully, will have an answer soon (it's bugging me now for a few years ).