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steevy
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Joined: 25 Jul 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 12:20 pm    Post subject: loading the blaster Reply with quote

Any ideas on this?I have a few .1/charger loaded(stripper clip)through the top of the action,in this case the extra trigger would be to fire the rounds with the explosive armed the primary trigger would fire them with the explosive inert ie as a "ball" round.2/Via the revolver cylinder for the ball ammo plus one through the action for a"special" round fired by the extra trigger presumably explosive as we see in the film when Deckard misses Roy with his first shot.3/Removable magazine which also fits with 1,perhaps in preference to or a faster method than loading through the action,I've heard this is shown in the work print of the film.My best guess is 1 and 3 with 6 rounds, the ammo load for this weapon(remember this is a specialized piece for killing replicants who are not easy to kill).Offworld says 10 mm caseless others say 12 mm either way is fine far as I'm concerned.Other opinions?
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Noeland
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 6:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is truly a matter for the blaster fans I think.

I enjoy discussing the double triggers quite a bit. I like chatting about the blasters from the angle of realism, and fantasy, so get ready!

On the real steyr rifle the first trigger is a "set" trigger. Now, I think asthetically Ridley Scott just liked that it looked unconventional.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trigger_%28firearms%29

(check under the heading "mechanism")

But for our fantasy movie gun, I think you're theory about the second trigger being for the explosive round probably isn't far from what they were tinking, given that he used 1. But, I think he only has 1 loaded at a time. The "physics" of the gun being that it's only so big, I'm not sure it could hold too many.

And Ford is seen in a few promo shots with a finger on both triggers while using both hands, so I'm betting some thought went into why there were 2 triggers on the gun.

I know a few of our members have spoken with some of the prop folks from the film, so manybe they can enlighten us for this thread. Smile

I know that for me, I envisioned a magazine full of non-explosive rounds loaded in the front/bottom magazine, that feed backward into the revolving cylinder, pre-loading 5 rounds (I'm seeing caseless ammo being used). Then you switch out to a fresh mag, and have a total of 10 rounds.

The single explosive round loads by hand in the top bolt, and can only be fired by the front trigger. When the trigger is pulled, it engages the explosive round, bascially "drops" it into the barrel and fires it almost like a missile.

I even drew up some diagrams. I'll see if I can find them. I was working on a fantasy "cutaway" of the gun too for our fan film. I'll try and find those CDs.
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steevy
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 7:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[img]http://propsummit.com/upload/index.php?file=0725072016a.jpg[/img]
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steevy
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 7:53 pm    Post subject: ? Reply with quote

Why wont my images show??
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Noeland
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lemme see if I can get a pic to post OK.


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steevy
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 9:49 pm    Post subject: seem fine Reply with quote

I can see thumbnails and everything....http://propsummit.com/upload/278/0725072016a.jpg
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steevy
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 9:51 pm    Post subject: ok i think Reply with quote

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steevy
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 9:53 pm    Post subject: i know pics are poor Reply with quote

This is the Steyr SSG trigger group ,receiver and magazine,the above was from the front showing 5 round rotary mag....
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steevy
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 9:55 pm    Post subject: more Reply with quote

my holster
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steevy
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 9:56 pm    Post subject: last one Reply with quote

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andy
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 10:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would love to see scans of those Steyr Diagrams. The camera unfortunately doesn't show much more than a tease.
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Noeland
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2007 12:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

EGADS MAN!! Were those taken with your phone?? Shocked

I dig the diagrams, though keep in mind those are for the bolt action rifle, where the chamber is forward of the magazine. In the fantasy movie pistol, it has to be above the magazine, or even behind it, because there ain't nuthin' in front of it! Wink

I agree with Andy, scan those suckers in and repost them. Also, my friend, blur free pics please.
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steevy
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2007 8:13 pm    Post subject: yeah phone Reply with quote

Sorry guys I don't have a scanner yet.I was looking online for those diagrams,they might be around somewhere.
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racprops
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2007 9:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Phil and I used to have these talks, and I put some of our thoughts as an article on my web site.

http://www.racprops.com/issue4/brblaster/

Rich

Eveything old is new again...this is years old.
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steevy
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2007 7:36 pm    Post subject: Thanks Reply with quote

I have read that article Mr.Coyle......With the more recent models of the blaster showing the barrel perforations under the bolt my charger loading and secondary chamber ideas seem nixed.Maybe a gas expansion chamber(due to volatile propellant used?)but than why a bolt?Easy access because the propellant causes excessive fouling?(exceptible due to the weapons specialized nature perhaps)Might also cut down on excessive recoil and muzzle flip.The snubbie must be a bitch to fire with that short brrel.I'm still noodling this.Since some models include the Steyr-Pusch markings it seems maybe PK-D could mean Pistole Kanon-Dreyse?Anyone know better German? Very Happy
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racprops
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2007 8:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Granted with what we now know of what action the real prop does all these ideas are mood...

The real barrel is whole with no holes in it, that is Sid's ideas, or more, perhaps a way past the import problems.

The travel of the real bolt is only 1/2 inch. So it really can not do much.
The one idea I would have is it is used to cock or prime the grenade for firing.

My tip barrel and rifle grenade is of course dead, based on the real prop.

The magnetic loading of rounds is still alive.

The front trigger being the grenade trigger is still good.

Rich
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steevy
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2007 9:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The movie shows one round fired with considerable explosive effect(the first shot at Roy which detonates against a wall)If the holes aren't part of the "real"weapon perhaps it is a loading gate for the high explosive round(closing the bolt leaving it "cocked and locked with the second trigger firing it on the pull through).With 5 or perhaps 6 rounds in the box magazine that are simply simple hollow point type rounds(they make some nasty deforming rounds now,imagine 2019 against replicants.no Geneva convention protecting them).I'm anxious to see the workprint because Deckard supposedly reloads.That would be after Roy breaks his fingers and gives Deckard his gun back,who than fires 3 rounds through the opening clipping Roy in the ear with one.He fired twice at Pris,(3 times in the International cut)four times at Roy,including the one that makes the big bang.If he reloads after that it means he has 6(or 7)total .The comic book has Deckard's voice over saying(I reloaded on the run)but I can't remember the voiceover version anymore so I don't know if he says it in the movie.Forgive the rambling post but I put thought into this crap... Very Happy
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racprops
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2007 10:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It be OK, so have we...

Yes I felt that if there was a grenade that was when it was used.

Now I feel the upper barrel carries the grenade round and is its firing system, so a short cocking action to arm it and cock the hammer and pull the front trigger to fire.

Reloading of it...I can not even guess, front load??

I liked the idea of a Gatling gun, auto reloading of rounds with in the cylinder giving something like 10 to 15 rounds total and with the revolver action, it is very reliable.

The best of both worlds, a self reloading revolver.

Rich
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steevy
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 28, 2007 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I guess it's possible he cocks/chambers the grenade round while we see Roy coming up in the elevator.If they do show him reloading after firing at Roy it could mean he only has 6 or 7 rounds,but it's possible he wanted a full loadout to take on Batty.
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pulseriflefan
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2007 6:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Since some models include the Steyr-Pusch markings it seems maybe PK-D could mean Pistole Kanon-Dreyse?Anyone know better German?


yes, but I think PK-D means "Philip K. Dick" who wrote the book "Do androids dream of electric sheeps ?"
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