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Buch
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 8:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kurtyboy is some kind of God I'm sure.....

http://propsummit.com/viewtopic.php?t=2499&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0
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joberg
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 5:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, here you go...Kurtyboy to the rescue Cool I cannot believe it has been more than 4 years since that project Crying or Very sad
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Buch
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 14, 2015 10:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

One thing I've learned so far from reading the ref pic thread and going through the material is this:




So apparently there's a large VK and a small VK? I got my LED's today and scaling the machine after them, it will only be 32 cm wide.... Shocked
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8th_Passenger
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 14, 2015 10:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anders,

The difference between the two machines is because of the monitors I think.

The unit on the left is the one modified for use in the UK, when they did close ups.

The one on the right is the one used in the US.

The UK use PAL format and the USA use NTSC.

They had to reconfigure the machine to make it work in the UK.

Hence the differences.

Which do you choose!


Colin
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Buch
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 14, 2015 10:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ah! That explains it... I just thought they were different stages of building the prop...

I have to say that I like the left model more, the "small one".... I like the more compact look, and to me at least it looks more harmonic, and in a sense also more iconic... Because it's the one seen in closeups.

Going with that means that I will need one 5 inch display and 2 two inch displays...


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joberg
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 15, 2015 10:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I went for the Mike Fink version (the first and only V.K. in my book).
The U.K. one is too big (main monitor, according to my calculation should only be around 4") and the baffles are on some kind of "block" making the machine bulky and less streamlined.

32 cm sounds right, mine was 32 cm wide, 431/2 cm long by 6cm thick.
I hope your eyes are o.k. Very Happy ...keep up the good work.
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8th_Passenger
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 15, 2015 12:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm with you joberg. The Mike fink version is the better of the two.

The UK version has lost some of it's good visual lines.

I think Anders meant the length across the front was 32cm?

Anders if you draw a rough plan view of the machine at 32cm it may seem a little small!


Colin
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Buch
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 15, 2015 3:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I guess I just have odd preferences Wink I definitely like the one with the narrow edges around the main display better (that would be the UK version?)... Concerning the block that the baffles rest upon, I agree, that looks clumsy... And I probably wouldn't include that.

The 32 cm is measured across the front of the VK... But I suspect that the light bar that I used for scaling is too small. At a width of 32 cm the machine is tiny... I need to make some drawings to get more perspective on it.

Joberg, what measurement is this: 431/2 cm? I don't quite get it...
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 15, 2015 4:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think joberg means 43.5cm.

I may be wrong here but I was under the impression that the two machines are in fact the same machine. But modified to fit PAL monitors. So the base, arm, bellows etc are the same (Mike Fink unit) If you follow. The bigger monitor has been added, so the vac form top has had to be re done.

My brain is starting to hurt again just thinking about this prop.


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Buch
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 16, 2015 4:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

One other difference, as Joberg also mentions, is this weird box that the bellows rest upon... Perhaps if the UK monitor was bigger, they needed more space for electronics inside?



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nickdaring
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 16, 2015 4:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the box was just to raise up the bellows so that the pump action was more visible with the new larger main monitor.
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joberg
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 16, 2015 5:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, you're right Colin: 43.5cm and Nick you're right too: that add-on box is to show the bellows better, or at least to have the same kind of "visuals" as on the Mike Fink prop.
We don't know if the U.K. machine was with an arm, since the tight shot keeps us to see it (emphasis was on the screens).
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Buch
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2015 3:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That explains the box, thanks again guys Very Happy

The latest scaling estimation I did suggested a width across the front of 42 cm. That's pretty close to 43,5 cm

EDIT: There is definitely something in the background of the closeup photos that suggests some kind of arm... Or at least something to give the impression of the arm.
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joberg
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2015 5:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes Anders, there's something out of focus back there Confused I mean, so many little details are wrong with the U.K. one, it 's not even funny.

1) No V.K. logo at the front of the machine (logo should be on the bottom left hand-side of the screen)

2) The Voight-Kampff plate atop the big screen should be off to the right hand side of the screen and not in the middle (U.K. one).

3) No piping on top of the small 2 box screen (piping are going from the 4 buttons to the side of the small screens).

4) Thickness of the machine had to be increased (ribs on top of the 3 right hand side buttons is larger than on the Mike Fink one).

Rant over
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joberg
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2015 7:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just in folks,

I had contacted Mike Fink at USC (Tom Southwell had raised that possibility a year ago if I'm not mistaken).
I had asked if he had any pics, measurements and the likes ( I also attached one pic of my latest attempt at the prop).

Here's his response:

Hello Jean-Louis -

Your version of the V-K machine looks pretty good. The machine was build in a huge rush by a team of 12 of us, and it was an intensely collaborative, around the clock effort. Only a few pictures exist, and no measurements. We had a Syd Mead sketch which we used as inspiration, and then made decisions based on our own design aesthetic and practical necessities of creating the V-K machine in 4 days. So there is little help I can be. I will go through my stuff and look for some pictures, but I know there isn't much. Do you know a fellow named Gene Kozicki? He would be a better source than I. I will forward your mail to him in case you don't yet know each other.

Best,

Michael


Michael Fink

Professor

USC School of Cinematic Arts
Chair, Film and Television Production
Georges Méličs Endowed Chair in Visual Effects
Kortschak Family Endowed Division Chair in Film and Television Production

So here it is; I think Gene is a member on the RPF, but I'm not a 100% sure since his handle doesn't mention his family name.
I'm eager to see what Mike Fink will find in his record (would be nice to have something/anything).

I will share with you guys any news I have, either from Mr. Fink or Mr. Kozicki.

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Buch
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2015 3:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow, I really hope that we hear from Mr Fink again, would be awesome. Any kind of information is good information, and would for my part be accepted as a great present!

Thanks for sharing the message from Mr Fink, Joberg Very Happy

The whole UK/US version discussion is not all that important to me. There are details on both machines that I like and that I dislike. Both machines (I presume) are in the movie, and yes, perhaps the UK guys did a poor job, and perhaps it should have been the US prop all the way... But it's not that important to me, to be honest.

The prop I'm planning will definitely be a mix of the two. I like the bigger display on the UK, but hate the bellows box...
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joberg
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2015 6:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I hear you Anders, but to put the big U.K. screen in your design, you run the problem of having a kind of "design break-out".
The Mike Fink machine had 5 bellows with a smaller main screen.
If you want to achieve the same kind of look, you'll have to increase the number of bellows.
Difficult to juggle two different designs to make one (not impossible mind you).

Eager to see what kind of prop you'll cook for us Wink
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Buch
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 19, 2015 1:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You're right, Joberg. All in all the bellows are (along with the intricate work that the arm requires) one of the things I fear the most about this prop build...

At the moment I'm still juggling the whole display question, and figuring out how to actually get them to work... Using some advice from some quite brilliant guys on an electronics forum, I think the way to go is using Raspberry Pi's to run the displays. They're basically tiny and cheap computers the size of a credit card:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/3d/RaspberryPi.jpg

By the way, I know fully understand why we don't see that many replicas of this prop Shocked And my respect for your build, Joberg, gets bigger and bigger by every minute I study the reference pics....
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 21, 2015 8:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I did the bellows by hand (no vacu-forming) and once you have the shape, it's easy to build using plastic (Syntra in my case). You just have 5 of them and the bottom last is not moving (if you're thinking about making them move up and down). Wink

The arm is another matter. Mine is wrong in that the back wheel should be flat and black (see Stephen Dane pic for that detail).

Keep up the good work
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Buch
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 25, 2015 3:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tiny bit of progress! See what this is?




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