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Buch
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 08, 2017 3:30 am    Post subject: Thoughts about Joi - SPOILERS Reply with quote

I've been reading a few threads, reviews etc. about BR2049 since seeing it yesterday, and there seems to be an opinion that Joi's role is superfluous... So I just wanted to share my thoughts about why she's in the movie, and also hear your thoughts about her....

This is how I see her:

1) Classical manic pixie dream girl, who can bring every lonely man out of his depression. I see loneliness as a key theme of the movie.

2) Symbol of the (creepy) transcendency between commercialism and existential longing, thereby thematizing the influence of capitalism in society and the needs it creates (like the original?)

3) Nostalgic symbol of the 50's-60's housewife, and the longing for a classical nuclear family. I see relations as another key theme (And thank God the movie focusses on relations over revolution, which would have been an even bigger cliché!).

4) K needs somebody to bloody talk to!

5) Hot girls sell tickets etc.

But basically her character makes perfect sense to me, and to me the movie wouldn't work without her....

What do you guys think?
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retrogarde
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 08, 2017 9:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joi felt like a more interactive and visually interesting version of the mood-changing device from DADoES. She felt very much a part of a PKD world.

Having said that, the scene in the rain on the roof and the sex scene could easily have been trimmed down to reduce the runtime without losing the character entirely.
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Buch
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 08, 2017 9:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

retrogarde wrote:
Joi felt like a more interactive and visually interesting version of the mood-changing device from DADoES. She felt very much a part of a PKD world.

Having said that, the scene in the rain on the roof and the sex scene could easily have been trimmed down to reduce the runtime without losing the character entirely.


Yes, the roof top scene is beautifully executed, but seems redundant to me too.
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joberg
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 08, 2017 3:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joi has achieved a certain "humanity" in K's eyes and I don't see the roof-top, nor the "sex scene" as fillers. He really believe that the "experience" will benefit them both.
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andy
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 09, 2017 12:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

***spoilers****The most Noir part of the film. A love affair that is tragic no matter what happens. One of the most powerful parts of the film. I think there may have been a comment, but there the concept from the first film where Rachael was designed for Deckard to fall in love with her. Didn't Wallace also say something about that to Deckard after he showed him the Rachael clone? Maybe Wallace designed Joi for K, to find Deckard? In my script I played off the idea of Rachael to be designed not only for Deckard to fall in love with based on memories that they already knew about, like the unicorn, but also to test out if he could make Replicants that can breed. Tyrell even bribed Gaff to let them go. It was the center of my script, but I also thought there should be more than just them. Making replicant prodedgy rare seems a kind of rip off from Children of Men. I love the idea of Nexus meaning Next Us. Since many places on earth were supposed to be uninhabitable, he was not only trying to make replicants that could survive harsh space conditions, he could also make them adapted to the harsh conditions on earth, and take over from mankind on earth since many of them were leaving. I love the story about Deckard and his Daughter and Ks conflict with his memories. It really is a great twist, but the effect of twits never lasts more than one or two viewings. Kind of simple plot overall though. I like mine better still, because it has so much more than this. Still need to publish, but now I wish I had done it before the release of this film. I had a few similarities to the new film including this. Now I can't claim I got there first...oh well...Lol

Andy
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Buch
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 09, 2017 3:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

joberg wrote:
Joi has achieved a certain "humanity" in K's eyes and I don't see the roof-top, nor the "sex scene" as fillers. He really believe that the "experience" will benefit them both.


I definitely see what you mean, good point, Joberg!
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Buch
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 09, 2017 3:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

andy wrote:
The most Noir part of the film. A love affair that is tragic no matter what happens. One of the most powerful parts of the film.


Totally agrees with this.
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joberg
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 09, 2017 10:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You're right Andy and this movie could be all of those possibilities!!
It's because you don't know/you're not sure of those feelings that K has for Joi or even Joi for K , is what makes their story so tragic and beautiful at the same time.
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Vader
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 10, 2017 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To me, Joi — the most "artificial" of all the characters — is in the end, the most human of them all.

Throughout the whole movie, both my wife and myself found that she was the only character we really felt engaged in, or cared about.
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Phil_Resch
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 10, 2017 7:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

After watching 2049 I immediately downloaded Her by Spike Jonze. Joi borrows a lot from the character Samantha from Her.

Joi's plot is one of my favorite in the film.
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Buch
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 4:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Phil_Resch wrote:
After watching 2049 I immediately downloaded Her by Spike Jonze. Joi borrows a lot from the character Samantha from Her.

Joi's plot is one of my favorite in the film.


Really interesting point!
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marcuslaw
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 4:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You fellas have given me something to seriously think about. I have to admit being a viewer who left thinking the Joi plotline was superfluous, a filler of sorts. In fact, the next time I watch it, not likely until it arrives on 3-D/UHD Blu-ray, I'm sure I'm now going to see her character differently. Thanks.
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Buch
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 11:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

marcuslaw wrote:
You fellas have given me something to seriously think about. I have to admit being a viewer who left thinking the Joi plotline was superfluous, a filler of sorts. In fact, the next time I watch it, not likely until it arrives on 3-D/UHD Blu-ray, I'm sure I'm now going to see her character differently. Thanks.


VERY happy to hear that!
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Nexus7
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 12:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Loved the character. I was talking to a friend about the film and she couldn't remember her name so she just kept calling her, "Siri."
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 4:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think Joi's tale echoes —in a much more simplified form— the journey of Andrew Martin, the (filmic) Bicentennial Man, who chooses to die if it's the one thing needed to be validated as a "real human".

In my opinion, the oversimplification of that path to its mere bones for the Joi character, can be attributed to the time constraints of a film where she was _not_ the focus of the main story. Would intrigue me to see it play slowly and subtly over one season or even two, if 2049 was a series. *Would* being the key word here... in no way I am asking for a BR tv/netflix series.
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